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6 points versus 12 point sockets

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6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby kracksmith » Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:00 pm

i'm in the market to buy a nice socket set. the one i have now is a craftsman 12 point. i don't know why they ever made this to do 6 point nuts as i striped my fair share of 6 points nuts with these 12 point sockets.

the purpose of 12 point is so it can mainly do other version nuts such as square and star nuts, and then the creator said it can also barely work on 6 point nuts?

this new set i plan to buy is solely for my crx so i was thinking dewalt 6 point metric socket set? or are there something better for the money?
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Wed Jun 01, 2016 10:18 pm

You want nice, this is nice. And made in America and Grade A equipment.

https://www.amazon.com/Armstrong-44-315 ... et+set+3+8
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Mista Bone » Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:02 pm

Get all 6 point sockets, then a 3/8" 10mm and 17mm 12 point for doing clutch/flywheel.

Impact sockets from Harbor Freight have never failed me, al long as you have room for the larger diameter sockets, everything else is Craftsman, well now called Crapsman for a reason.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby ohisofly » Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:28 pm

Mista Bone wrote:Get all 6 point sockets, then a 3/8" 10mm and 17mm 12 point for doing clutch/flywheel.

Impact sockets from Harbor Freight have never failed me, al long as you have room for the larger diameter sockets, everything else is Craftsman, well now called Crapsman for a reason.

:-)b

How much are you willing to spend? Personally I think it's worth it to have quality high tooth ratchets, snap-on is what I have. 1/4" and 3/8" are ideal, if you don't do much with 1/2" then a snap on ratchet isn't really worth it.

As far as the sockets themselves you typically get what you pay for, but harbor freight and craftsman should suffice. I wouldn't spend $400 on a 29 piece socket set :wink:
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Thu Jun 02, 2016 12:04 am

ohisofly wrote:
Mista Bone wrote:Get all 6 point sockets, then a 3/8" 10mm and 17mm 12 point for doing clutch/flywheel.

Impact sockets from Harbor Freight have never failed me, al long as you have room for the larger diameter sockets, everything else is Craftsman, well now called Crapsman for a reason.

:-)b

How much are you willing to spend? Personally I think it's worth it to have quality high tooth ratchets, snap-on is what I have. 1/4" and 3/8" are ideal, if you don't do much with 1/2" then a snap on ratchet isn't really worth it.

As far as the sockets themselves you typically get what you pay for, but harbor freight and craftsman should suffice. I wouldn't spend $400 on a 29 piece socket set :wink:


He said he wanted NICE and seemed to not be satisfied with his Craftsman. LOL

for a regular shade tree mechanic Craftsman is all well and good. But, if it's your job to work with tools on the daily, like yourself, then Snap-on would certainly be the way to go. Especially since they come to you for service and exchange.

I have mostly Craftsman in my box but certainly my Snap-On stuff is my favorites to use.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Thu Jun 02, 2016 12:15 am

And BTW, if you are looking to get some Snap-On/Blue Point stuff, check eBay. There are a few pawn shops that have some stuff listed that you can get for a very good price.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby kracksmith » Thu Jun 02, 2016 12:23 am

that amazon link for 400 bucks is too much even though i said nice.

i'm narrowing down to 6 point dewalt or carlyetools. dewalt being way cheaper and i think it's on par with Craftsman when it was USA made.

http://www.carlyletools.com/products/sockets
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Mista Bone » Thu Jun 02, 2016 2:26 am

Don't forget Kobalt @ Lowes, was once made by Snap-On without the built in "free"
financing.

Use the tools right and they will last. My 14mm 3/8" sockets die, but they are the only ones that would fix on OBX installs and I was (mis)using an impact gun in the process.

I have one Snap-On tool, bearing puller because it works. Now their digital TQ wrenches, I wouldn't buy unless tested on the truck before purchase.

I left my (Dad's from 1971) 1/2 TQ wrench on 85 ft/lbs for wheels, never backed it down, THE carnal sin right? I got it tested by the Snap-On guy, was in spec, but on the edge of needing recalibrated. Fine, I'm not doing repair work as a daily job.

SO dealer whipped out a new digtal unit, vibrates and tickles your gonads with each bolt and nut torqued. It was out of spec. So he pulled out another.....Three of the five NEW IN BOX units had to be sent back to be calibrated.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Gr8_EE8 » Thu Jun 02, 2016 3:18 am

These are pretty good, made in TW just like Snap-on: https://www.amazon.com/GearWrench-80550 ... socket+set

I own socket sets from Proto, Armstrong, SK, Craftsman, Husky, hf, and a few more. Six point sockets are usually the ones that break, but ymmv. Good 12-points bite better and are less likely to round off bolt heads because 1- they don't flex like a 6-point under torque, and 2- they have a better included angle at the corners than most 6-points. They can't be made as thin, but that's why they make 6-points.

My top choice would be SK Tools sockets used with Geawrench XP ratchets. Last set you'll ever need to buy. But I'm just some guy on the internet.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:09 pm

Gr8_EE8 wrote:My top choice would be SK Tools sockets used with Geawrench XP ratchets. Last set you'll ever need to buy. But I'm just some guy on the internet.


SK's are good stuff. And i LOVE my Gearwrench wrenches.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:33 pm

Gr8_EE8 wrote:These are pretty good, made in TW just like Snap-on: https://www.amazon.com/GearWrench-80550 ... socket+set

I own socket sets from Proto, Armstrong, SK, Craftsman, Husky, hf, and a few more. Six point sockets are usually the ones that break, but ymmv. Good 12-points bite better and are less likely to round off bolt heads because 1- they don't flex like a 6-point under torque, and 2- they have a better included angle at the corners than most 6-points. They can't be made as thin, but that's why they make 6-points.

My top choice would be SK Tools sockets used with Geawrench XP ratchets. Last set you'll ever need to buy. But I'm just some guy on the internet.


6 point is better for not stripping the bolt head. Don't know what you are talking about.

Depends on size of bolt. Smaller bolts, 6 point is better as less chance of stripping the head.

12 point sockets are better suited for 12 point bolt heads. Only advantage of using 12 point sockets on a 6 point fastener is speed ie: socket readjustment in tight areas
Last edited by crocrx on Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:42 pm

I am a professional mechanic by trade and let me tell you, tools have come a long way in quality today. Snapon is too expensive. You can get equal or similar quality going with KD USA, Proto, Armstrong and Craftsman USA. I have every tool brand you can imagine.

Ever heard of Tekton ? They're a great affordable tool company. Quality is good.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Gr8_EE8 » Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:46 am

crocrx wrote:6 point is better for not stripping the bolt head. Don't know what you are talking about.


Obviously not. :doh: But then again, I don't use the wrong size socket on my bolts, either. Like I said, I'm just some guy on the internet who doesn't feel any need to brag about credentials. But for however many wrenches I'm not claiming to have turned, I have rounded more tight bolt heads that are 9/16 and under with 6-point sockets than with 12's. I have broken more 6-point sockets in the 1/2-3/4" range than 12's. Bigger stuff doesn't round out, and I don't care how many points. Really big stuff (I have 24-point sockets up to 4-1/2" or so, because guys on the internet tend to have and do everything) is much nicer with more points of engagement, because you are more likely to be using a breaker bar that has only 4 starts, not a ratchet, and need all the options you can get. No, impacts and power tools are not an option in certain industrial work environments, so even big stuff may be done by hand. So unless you need a thin-walled shell socket to reach a recessed bolt that a normal socket won't fit, for automotive work 12 point is the way to go.
:deadhorse:
Now what's better, metric or SAE? :rolleyes1:
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:54 am

Who said anything about wrong size sockets ? I am saying 6 point sockets strip the heads off small bolts less than 12 point. I do this everyday for a living.

So you're asking what's better metric or sae ? In what sense ?




Gr8_EE8 wrote:
crocrx wrote:6 point is better for not stripping the bolt head. Don't know what you are talking about.


Obviously not. :doh: But then again, I don't use the wrong size socket on my bolts, either. Like I said, I'm just some guy on the internet who doesn't feel any need to brag about credentials. But for however many wrenches I'm not claiming to have turned, I have rounded more tight bolt heads that are 9/16 and under with 6-point sockets than with 12's. I have broken more 6-point sockets in the 1/2-3/4" range than 12's. Bigger stuff doesn't round out, and I don't care how many points. Really big stuff (I have 24-point sockets up to 4-1/2" or so, because guys on the internet tend to have and do everything) is much nicer with more points of engagement, because you are more likely to be using a breaker bar that has only 4 starts, not a ratchet, and need all the options you can get. No, impacts and power tools are not an option in certain industrial work environments, so even big stuff may be done by hand. So unless you need a thin-walled shell socket to reach a recessed bolt that a normal socket won't fit, for automotive work 12 point is the way to go.
:deadhorse:
Now what's better, metric or SAE? :rolleyes1:
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:28 pm

crocrx wrote:Ever heard of Tekton ? They're a great affordable tool company. Quality is good.


I just bought all new impact sockets from them. Haven't had a chance to break them in yet. :cry:
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby jfrolang » Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:59 pm

Gr8_EE8 wrote:I have rounded more tight bolt heads that are 9/16 and under with 6-point sockets than with 12's.

Baloney. The more points you have in a socket, the closer it is to a circle. It's like you're saying 6-point every time you meant to say 12-point and vice versa.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby 7PSI CRX » Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:05 pm

In 3/8' drive:

All my deep socket sets are 6 point,
and all my shallow socket sets are 12 point.
(I do have a few 6 point shallow and 1 or 2 12 point deep, but hardly ever use them)

My 1/2" drive sets.....

Same deal.


Wrench sets are all 12 point combinations.

Stripping the head of a bolt is almost unheard of,
using the combination of tools above, I'll (usually) break a bolt before I strip one.


I think "variety" is the key, never getting stuck without a tool necessary for that particular application.

Many times due to tight spaces, only a 12 point something would ever work.

Who designs that type of stuff?

LOL
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:25 pm

jfrolang wrote:
Gr8_EE8 wrote:I have rounded more tight bolt heads that are 9/16 and under with 6-point sockets than with 12's.

Baloney. The more points you have in a socket, the closer it is to a circle. It's like you're saying 6-point every time you meant to say 12-point and vice versa.


Thank you :)
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:26 pm

Cementups wrote:
crocrx wrote:Ever heard of Tekton ? They're a great affordable tool company. Quality is good.


I just bought all new impact sockets from them. Haven't had a chance to break them in yet. :cry:



I have been using Tekton impact sockets at work for the past 4 years ! No problems at all. Only downside is they're not engraved with the size.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby kracksmith » Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:48 am

ok i'm looking up Tekton 6 point, and it's only under 40 bucks?? this is not HF stuff right?

http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-13101-8-In ... B00RCYX4WI
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Cementups » Sat Jun 04, 2016 9:23 am

kracksmith wrote:ok i'm looking up Tekton 6 point, and it's only under 40 bucks?? this is not HF stuff right?

http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-13101-8-In ... B00RCYX4WI


Not at all. They are very well reviewed though. That's why I bought them. Got them and they seem pretty solid. I could see many years of satisfaction with them.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Gr8_EE8 » Sat Jun 04, 2016 2:27 pm

jfrolang wrote:
Gr8_EE8 wrote:I have rounded more tight bolt heads that are 9/16 and under with 6-point sockets than with 12's.

Baloney. The more points you have in a socket, the closer it is to a circle. It's like you're saying 6-point every time you meant to say 12-point and vice versa.


Not at all. The included angle is more acute on a well-designed 12-point, so it does not contact the corners of the bolt head. The load is placed inboard from the corners. 6-points usually have some kind of small recess in the corners, too, but the bolt corners slide like a wedge under the load bearing surface, forcing the socket to open like a bell until the whole thing slips and rounds the heads. Six points are usually meant to be thinner for recessed bolts, they are more flexy. Ask your Matco guy next time he comes around where you work.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby jfrolang » Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:49 am

They're still 120 degree angles on a hex head until fundamental geometry changes. The included angle has nothing to do with the number of points in a socket. Nor does the wall thickness, or for that matter the strength of the metal. At this point you just appear to be trolling or terribly confused.
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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby Gr8_EE8 » Tue Jun 07, 2016 12:27 pm

Here. I just changed the fundamental rules of geometry and altered the included angle of a 12 point socket. This is what any name brand tool does.
Image

And this is why I don't particularly like 6-points.
Image

I can't say much more other than to think about it.

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Re: 6 points versus 12 point sockets

Postby crocrx » Tue Jun 07, 2016 12:32 pm

Gr8_EE8 wrote:Here. I just changed the fundamental rules of geometry and altered the included angle of a 12 point socket. This is what any name brand tool does.
Image

And this is why I don't particularly like 6-points.
Image

I can't say much more other than to think about it.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk



Exactly. Force exerted is against the flat, not the corner.
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